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The Counter Narrative Podcast Season 3, Episode 8: Interview with Katie Kinder

The Counter Narrative Podcast Season 3, Episode 8: Interview with Katie Kinder


Welcome to the Counter Narrative Podcast, a show designed to change the way we talk, and think, about education. By sharing stories of successes and triumphs, we aim to challenge the dominant narrative that often negatively portrays our disenfranchised populations.

I’m your host, Charles Williams. An educator for 15 years, a current school principal in Chicago, and an educational consultant.

Let’s get started.

In this episode, I chat with Katie Kinder who has been an educator since 2006. She believes that life is fun, and learning should most definitely be fun. As a teacher of the year, top five district finalist, OKC Rotary Teacher of the Month, a guest on the Oklahoma State Department’s EdTalk series, and a top 100 educator in Oklahoma on Twitter, Katie has learned a trick or two in the classroom, so be sure to check her out, have some fun, and hook your students from day one!

During our conversation, we discussed the importance of allowing students to see themselves in their work. While Katie is a huge fan of Edgar Allen Poe, she also knew that her students should be exposed to poets such as Maya Angelou especially when so many of her students didn’t even recognize this prolific author. Like so many others, she pushes back on the idea of doing things the same way simply because and even challenges those using the current pandemic as an excuse for not making needed change. Katie puts actions behinds her words of “don’t expect your kids to do what you aren’t willing to do yourself” by trying to develop a new district-wide approach to PD – one that would turn her classroom into a living workshop where teachers could witness the implementation of strategies in real-time.

I guarantee this episode will have you hooked. Enjoy!

I want to thank you for listening to The Counter Narrative Podcast. If you like what you are hearing, please be sure to like and subscribe. The show can be found on Anchor, Google Podcasts, Apple Podcasts, and several of your other favorite platforms.

This podcast is also featured on, where you can find educational articles, videos, and interviews with educators from around the globe.

Be sure to connect with the host and other listeners by following the show on Twitter at @theCNpodcast and joining the show’s Facebook Group.

Charles Williams has served in urban education for 15 years as a teacher, assistant principal, and principal while working with students in grades PK - 12. He has developed innovative programs and structures that have resulted in successful schools in both Indiana and Illinois. He has also presented and spoken at numerous events. Charles is the founder of CW Consulting, an Educational Consulting Group, the host of the Counter Narrative Podcast, and the host of Real Educators Talk, a monthly discussion designed to engage educators in authentic conversations around education.


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